I need to vent about women

[Redrain]

That’s a very good point on the conversation; some women could potentially just be nervous. Potentially just trying to impress you. But then I ask myself…. Do I want a women who is that insecure about themselves? Probably not. Most women would reject a guy instantly who is unsure of themselves. Happens all the time. It’s unattractive.

I’ve dated insecure women. Have you? It’s utterly pointless outside of free sex.

What we are discussing here is basic stats. You are ignoring stats. You were provided with ample data and you just skip over it- like it doesn’t exist.

I’m happy to hear that whatever system has worked for you makes you happy. I mean that- that’s good.

But to be pretty honest- my system has made me happy too. As outlined above- I just had major surgery. If there is ever a time when a man might feel like he needs a woman in his life; it’s during times of being debilitated. But to be fair I’m just fine dealing with it myself. I don’t really need anyone.

And I would so much rather be single then date the shit that is currently on the modern dating market. I’m not going to reduce myself to it. I do have confidence; confidence enough to know that the modern dating market is shit and I ll die alone before I settle. It’s okay. When I need sex I can get it. That’s it and that’s enough and I am pretty happy.

If you're happy the way things are going for you and you really believe the things you do about women, then it sounds like you just don't like women all that much.

I'm not saying you aren't straight, just that it sounds like you don't really like women.

This whole exchange, I was working from the position that we were fundamentally the same in that we both liked women, not just sexually, but enjoyed being around women and sharing time with them.

But I think I am beginning to understand that you and the people who believe the things about women that you do don't actually like women. I mean how could you like women as a whole and at the same time believe all the things you believe about them as a group.

So it makes sense that you won't go to what I see as even a basic effort to meat women and form a connection with them. It also makes sense that you see my actions as begging or "putting pussy on a pedestal".

Because I enjoy being with women the efforts I go to be with them don't seem like efforts to me at all.

But since you don't really like women, any real effort comes off as insulting and a waste.

Why put in even a once of effort to be with someone that you may be attracted to but actually have a pretty low opinion of as a group?

I enjoy being with women so my interactions with them feel to me like a dance.

You don't like being with women so your interactions with them must feel to you like a boring work argument.

An interaction you don't really want to be a part off with a person you don't really want to be around any longer than absolutely necessary.

I think that is the fundamental difference between us and why we keep hitting a wall in trying to explain our views to each other.

Plus if you really feel about women the way you do, chances are most women woul not want to waste their time with you in the same way you don't want to waste your time with most women.

With that in mind I guess I'll end my side of this conversation by saying that in my experience women aren't nearly as bad as you think.

The ones I've met and spent time with weren't perfect but on the whole they were kind, wanted to be with me, wanted me to want them, and tried (each in their own way) to make me happy for the time we were together.

I've been lucky in this, but I also think these experiences came in part from my genuinely liking women.

See ya in the funny papers!

 

[PorterD]

If you're happy the way things are going for you and you really believe the things you do about women, then it sounds like you just don't like women all that much.

I'm not saying you aren't straight, just that it sounds like you don't really like women.

This whole exchange, I was working from the position that we were fundamentally the same in that we both liked women, not just sexually, but enjoyed being around women and sharing time with them.

But I think I am beginning to understand that you and the people who believe the things about women that you do don't actually like women. I mean how could you like women as a whole and at the same time believe all the things you believe about them as a group.

So it makes sense that you won't go to what I see as even a basic effort to meat women and form a connection with them. It also makes sense that you see my actions as begging or "putting pussy on a pedestal".

Because I enjoy being with women the efforts I go to be with them don't seem like efforts to me at all.

But since you don't really like women, any real effort comes off as insulting and a waste.

Why put in even a once of effort to be with someone that you may be attracted to but actually have a pretty low opinion of as a group?

I enjoy being with women so my interactions with them feel to me like a dance.

You don't like being with women so your interactions with them must feel to you like a boring work argument.

An interaction you don't really want to be a part off with a person you don't really want to be around any longer than absolutely necessary.

I think that is the fundamental difference between us and why we keep hitting a wall in trying to explain our views to each other.

Plus if you really feel about women the way you do, chances are most women woul not want to waste their time with you in the same way you don't want to waste your time with most women.

With that in mind I guess I'll end my side of this conversation by saying that in my experience women aren't nearly as bad as you think.

The ones I've met and spent time with weren't perfect but on the whole they were kind, wanted to be with me, wanted me to want them, and tried (each in their own way) to make me happy for the time we were together.

I've been lucky in this, but I also think these experiences came in part from my genuinely liking women.

See ya in the funny papers!

Ha! Totally untrue! In fact I probably like women more than most guys here. Including you I imagine. The thing I’d always dreamed of was having a loyal wife who completed me. We got married, had a family, and spent the rest of our lives together. Committed. One women. One. No providers.

But this ideal simply does not exist and if it does; it’s very rare. 50 years ago it was a possibility. Now it isnt.

Your utter failure to see that basic reality is your problem.

So my actions aren’t from “disliking women” they are rooted in very basic reality.

And it’s not really women’s fault that they are fucked up. It’s a societal issue.

Your idea that I don’t want women is a joke because it’s the reverse that is true. Women don’t want me! And it’s not like there is anything wrong with me. I’m just your normal standard guy that is invisible to women because society has messed them up.

Sorry you can’t see reality for what it is.

Have a good one!

 

[PorterD]

You do realize I once got down on one knee and proposed to a woman and she said no.

No real reason for it. I wasnt a scumbag, I was a “good boyfriend” her words.

She just meh; wasn’t feeling it.

She went into to date some drug abuser. Now she is 40 and living with her parenrs. Single and miserable.

Why? Because women are fucked up because society fucked them up.

Tell me again how I am the problem!

 

[Redrain]

You do realize I once got down on one knee and proposed to a woman and she said no.

No real reason for it. I wasnt a scumbag, I was a “good boyfriend” her words.

She just meh; wasn’t feeling it.

She went into to date some drug abuser. Now she is 40 and living with her parenrs. Single and miserable.

Why? Because women are fucked up because society fucked them up.

Tell me again how I am the problem!

You must have loved her a lot to have asked her to marry you.

I've never proposed to anyone so I can't and am too scared to imagine what it was like to go through what you went through.

I know for a fact that I would have been devastated and really angry.

I think when it comes to our present experiences, we draw a lot from the things we've gone through.

All our good experiences create a reservoir of joy and all our bad experiences create a reservoir of pain.

I've been lucky enough to have some very good experiences with women and with life in general.

So when a woman rejects me or something else goes wrong in my life I can draw on my reservoir of joy to soften the blow.

But sometimes someone or something hits me in just the right way and all the anger and embarrassment from my pain reservoir boils over.

All I can say is that bravery and anger aren't the same thing.

And you aren't nearly as invisible to women as you think they think you are.

 

[AutomaticSlim]

Plus if you really feel about women the way you do, chances are most women woul not want to waste their time with you in the same way you don't want to waste your time with most women.

I have to comment on this.
So...many of the girls I have known in the past that I may have been willing to be with, well, they preferred guys who quite literally BEAT THE LIVING HELL OUT OF THEM.
So yeah...I may be an old fashioned traditionalist (and a gentleman) who expects cooking, cleaning and sex in return for financial support, but at least I never physically beat a girl or sent her to the emergency room. They seem to love those types of guys - the ones that beat them. Love them.

 

[VJLUTZ]

I have to comment on this.
So...many of the girls I have known in the past that I may have been willing to be with, well, they preferred guys who quite literally BEAT THE LIVING HELL OUT OF THEM.
So yeah...I may be an old fashioned traditionalist (and a gentleman) who expects cooking, cleaning and sex in return for financial support, but at least I never physically beat a girl or sent her to the emergency room. They seem to love those types of guys - the ones that beat them. Love them.

In my youth, I had a few girls tell me that I was "too nice". Had one girl flat out admit that she liked guys who "smacked her around a little". I've come to understand that it's a mental sickness on their part. Its a huge red flag and something to avoid in a mate at all cost. My theory is that these girls somehow believe that the guy who beats them up is better able to protect her and/or cares for her more (because anger). That's about as paradoxical as you can get, but that's women for ya. I've also heard it said that a bad-ass makes a girl's heart beat faster.

 

[VJLUTZ]

@hhnyc77 - I'm thinking there should be a specific forum for guys who want to be psycho-analyzed and the wannabe psychiatrists who want to "treat" them. That way we can just avoid the excess BS on otherwise legit threads. Anyway, just a suggestion.

 

[Koujiao]

I have to comment on this.
So...many of the girls I have known in the past that I may have been willing to be with, well, they preferred guys who quite literally BEAT THE LIVING HELL OUT OF THEM.
So yeah...I may be an old fashioned traditionalist (and a gentleman) who expects cooking, cleaning and sex in return for financial support, but at least I never physically beat a girl or sent her to the emergency room. They seem to love those types of guys - the ones that beat them. Love them.

what percentage of the ‘girls’ that you have knew in the past were you ‘willing to be with? and of them, what percentage were wanting a Beating? what kind of beating?

 

[AutomaticSlim]

what percentage of the ‘girls’ that you have knew in the past were you ‘willing to be with? and of them, what percentage were wanting a Beating? what kind of beating?

- Percentage of providers I would have been willing to be with - tiny
- Percentage of providers that wanted to be with me - infinitesimal - 3 in total. One dominican american and 2 koreans. I really didn't want them though. They played on my sympathy and made me feel sorry for them.
- Percentage of white american providers I've known who were enamored with abusive shitbags - almost all of them.

 

[이 회장님]

All of these women are angels compared to Ohtani’s former interpreter. lol

 

[Koujiao]

- Percentage of providers I would have been willing to be with - tiny
- Percentage of providers that wanted to be with me - infinitesimal - 3 in total. One dominican american and 2 koreans. I really didn't want them though. They played on my sympathy and made me feel sorry for them.
- Percentage of white american providers I've known who were enamored with abusive shitbags - almost all of them.

in my case, there is no reason any of these women woud want to be with me for any reason other than for transactional purposes. Play the Stones song ‘I’m not your stepping stone’.

i suppose the percentage of us who have been played based on our sympathy for their manufactured stories is quite high. Lessons are learned and in my walk of life, with each lesson I become less sympathetic, more hardened, skeptical and less emotionally accessible. But that urge never dies.

 

[VJLUTZ]

This is an oldie, but it is still the best pickup routine I've ever seen:

How To Pick Up Women, Vic Ferrari Style (youtube.com)

 

[AutomaticSlim]

This is an oldie, but it is still the best pickup routine I've ever seen:

How To Pick Up Women, Vic Ferrari Style (youtube.com)

That girl in the video clip had nice, long, straight, flat hair for the 80s.
Not the awful, crazy, curly, permed big hair they used to have back then.

 

[Black_equus]

The phenomenon that @PorterD and other posters have experienced is extraordinarily well documented.

The below link is to a Pew Research center study.

5 facts about single Americans for Valentine’s Day | Pew Research Center

And apparently Psychology Today trusts the study.

Why So Many Young Males Are Single and Sexless | Psychology Today

And countless YouTube podcastsers discuss the phenomenon constantly. Of these, two high quality ones (with millions of subscribers) are listed below.

The Number of Sexless Men Has Tripled in 10 Years (youtube.com)

“It’s An Emergency!” The Number Of Men Having No Sex Increased 180%! - The Relationships Professor (youtube.com)

But apparently none of that matters because you and your "friends" supposedly don't see it. Maybe in your mind, anecdotal evidence trumps everything else, but that's not how the scientific method works.

I'm also sure you'll tell me I need to post more evidence of better quality, but I'm not playing that game because there is zero chance you will concede the point. And frankly, I could not care less about that anyway.

However, maybe its time for you to buttress your credibility with some published studies/polls (from reputable organizations) that jive with your assertions? I'm not holding my breath though.

This report says young men watch too much porn. It does not blame feminism for the fact young dudes be banging their hands.

 

[Black_equus]

This does t work. As stated; unless you are a top 5% man; you are quite literally invisible to women.

Again- I suggest you setup a dating profile and try the experiment yourself or better yet try to pick up women in real life.

How many signals of interest do you currently get from women? Eye contact? Lingering in your vicinity? Attempting to chat with you? Ball park it. How often? One woman a month? One woman a year? Never?

This is just made up conclusion. Please show empirical evidence.

 

[VJLUTZ]

This report says young men watch too much porn. It does not blame feminism for the fact young dudes be banging their hands.

The Pew Research study does not mention porn at all. The Psychology Today article does. However, its an open question whether porn is the cause or effect. That is, does a porn addiction cause men to avoid women in-the-flesh? Or is the lack of receptive women causing more men to turn to porn? It's probably some of both. However, the below excerpt from the original study indicates that men are searching for relationships at higher rates than women. Given that, you can't just say that it's all due to porn. It's clearly women tuning men out too.

Single men are more likely than their female counterparts to be searching for romantic experiences. Half of these men are looking for a committed relationship and/or casual dates, while 35% of single women say the same.

Speaking for myself, watching porn makes me want to go out and bang some quim.

 

[Koujiao]

The Pew Research study does not mention porn at all. The Psychology Today article does. However, its an open question whether porn is the cause or effect. That is, does a porn addiction cause men to avoid women in-the-flesh? Or is the lack of receptive women causing more men to turn to porn? It's probably some of both. However, the below excerpt from the original study indicates that men are searching for relationships at higher rates than women. Given that, you can't just say that it's all due to porn. It's clearly women tuning men out too.

Single men are more likely than their female counterparts to be searching for romantic experiences. Half of these men are looking for a committed relationship and/or casual dates, while 35% of single women say the same.

Speaking for myself, watching porn makes me want to go out and bang some quim.

for me the porn rou refer to is neither and is both, depending on the circumstances. Mine, theirs, and so many other variables. And there is no lack of receptive women in my life, there is a lack of receptive and seeking me who porn stars in my life. They live in my mind, in the porn, and I want to believe in my neighbors house…so my imagination says.

 

[PorterD]

This is just made up conclusion. Please show empirical evidence.

Enjoy!

 

[markkennedy]

Enjoy!

Interesting data, but I don't see the chart data reflect its title? Where's the 36% in the chart

Now there might be some relationship between societal factors in the things people are seeing and citing in this topic. Women were property for all of history until say the last 4-5 generations (some even less, depending on culture). Women having personal earning potential did no exist until about 3-4 generations ago. Religiosity was a dominant social moral economic political force until say 2-3 generations ago. Internet is now 1 generation old. "finally free", might be the motivation for females finding their oats and getting out there with goal of getting fucked and then going back to whatever they do the other 90% of the time. Just like us mongers. In those past generations, a woman's mate might have been decided for her, either by her parents, her church, her hungry children, the weather, a war, and these all were true for ten thousand generations; an unbroken chain for most lineages of 10000 women who did not have any choice on which cock entered her body or whose hand they would take. "finally free".

All that, and there's a real thing that I see a lot today, and that's the dichotomy between dudes with 0% confidence, and they show it, and dudes who are alpha as fuck but completely unfunctional as productive persons. I meet these all day every day in my business, and if I were keeping score I'd say that for guys 18-35, 30% are in each camp, with just 40% who have some confidence level and are functional (can keep a job, don't beat anyone, don't drive drunk, have marketable skill and career potential, have more than 1 paycheck in the bank). Not sure what woman would want either of the 30% categories as a long-term mate, but is clear from interactions I witness that they are choosing the unfunctional dudes, not because they WANT to have the baby of a dude whose best job was three months, not because they WANT to live in a shithole apartment with a dude who drinks and beats her for no reason, but their internal code that codes them to be receptive to alpha men. For most of human history, being an alpha and beating the shit out of people was a highly sought-after skill for men, as this was the only thing separating most humans from being killed on a daily basis (by animals or the feudal lord or a neighbor or "the other") or starving to death twice a day (can't hunt and kill and gut a wild animal, you die!). Today and for a very few generations, not being a ruffian is a thing that produces results, but does not attract females. Some ladies are in love with money, but most women want a dude who matches their genetic code's demands. It might take many generations of evolution to uncode what took 10000 generations to code in. In the meantime, hobby on!

 

[Dynaguy]

Where's the 36% in the chart

It’s the green (like & match, 1.8%) divided by the sum of the green and blue (like & no match, 3.2%)