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Ok, Boomer
- Thread starter njlefty
- Start date
@charliebrown
And yes, I 100% agree there is too much pollution in the world.
Much of it coming from "developing" countries.
But we never really hear about that from the Al Gore types.
That maybe, just maybe, the overpopulated 3rd world is causing this problem.
And yet here we are, contributing to that overpopulation, by sending medicine, food, and sharing green tech with them.
And yes, I 100% agree there is too much pollution in the world.
Much of it coming from "developing" countries.
But we never really hear about that from the Al Gore types.
That maybe, just maybe, the overpopulated 3rd world is causing this problem.
And yet here we are, contributing to that overpopulation, by sending medicine, food, and sharing green tech with them.
We all, individually, need to follow the Oath of The Athenian State: transmit the city better and more beautiful than we found it.
I'm a responsible environmental steward and try to do the right thing. I don't fret about what others do. I expect that they do what I demand of myself.
Talk is just bullshit. Walk the walk, and you're doing good for others and the future.
I'm a responsible environmental steward and try to do the right thing. I don't fret about what others do. I expect that they do what I demand of myself.
Talk is just bullshit. Walk the walk, and you're doing good for others and the future.
Always good to have differing opinions. Here's a good book by Alex Epstein---"The Moral Case for Fossil Fuels". I found it very interesting. Here's a blurb:
"Conventional wisdom says fossil fuels are an unsustainable form of energy that is destroying our planet. But Alex Epstein shows that if we look at the big picture, the much-hated fossil fuel industry is dramatically improving our planet by making it a far safer and richer place.
The key difference between a healthy and unhealthy environment, Epstein argues, is development—the transformation of nature to meet human needs.
And the energy required for development is overwhelmingly made possible by the fossil fuel industry, the only way to produce cheap, plentiful, reliable energy on a global scale.
While acknowledging the challenges of fossil fuels (and every form of energy), Epstein argues that the overall benefits, including the largely ignored environmental benefits, are incomparably greater."
"Conventional wisdom says fossil fuels are an unsustainable form of energy that is destroying our planet. But Alex Epstein shows that if we look at the big picture, the much-hated fossil fuel industry is dramatically improving our planet by making it a far safer and richer place.
The key difference between a healthy and unhealthy environment, Epstein argues, is development—the transformation of nature to meet human needs.
And the energy required for development is overwhelmingly made possible by the fossil fuel industry, the only way to produce cheap, plentiful, reliable energy on a global scale.
While acknowledging the challenges of fossil fuels (and every form of energy), Epstein argues that the overall benefits, including the largely ignored environmental benefits, are incomparably greater."
This article may show an opposite argument:
https://ourworld.unu.edu/en/review-the-moral-case-for-fossil-fuels-really
https://ourworld.unu.edu/en/review-the-moral-case-for-fossil-fuels-really
Our efficiency in use of fossil fuels continue to improve.
Most plants produce energy at a range of 40 to 65 percent efficiency (the accepted engineering standard) compared to the theoretical maximum efficiency. Though improvements will likely be minor, it is realistic to seek a goal of 80 percent maximum theoretical long term. I do expect this to also flat line at some point in the future as efficiency nears closer to the maximum theoretical.
My problem with renewable energy production is due to the nature of the energy source (sunlight & wind is not as energy dense as coal) and the way it stores energy, we have already approached the point where improvements will be negligible. At this point it will have to be able to be mass produce and continue servicing these devices. That takes economical and environmental resources that could otherwise be going into expanding and maintaining our current nuclear energy infrastructure which produces more electricity today than all the "renewable" energies put together. Even when we haven't built a new nuclear facility since 1990 and have been heavily subsidizing every "green" program with taxpayer money nuclear is still the only realistic long-term strategy to resolve these issues. Though there will be safety and disposal concerns as well.
See the following page and article:
https://www.energy.gov/ne/articles/5-fast-facts-about-nuclear-energy
https://e360.yale.edu/features/why-...the-energy-solution-environmentalists-climate
But people are against nuclear energy so I guess until then I will support fossil fuels.
Most plants produce energy at a range of 40 to 65 percent efficiency (the accepted engineering standard) compared to the theoretical maximum efficiency. Though improvements will likely be minor, it is realistic to seek a goal of 80 percent maximum theoretical long term. I do expect this to also flat line at some point in the future as efficiency nears closer to the maximum theoretical.
My problem with renewable energy production is due to the nature of the energy source (sunlight & wind is not as energy dense as coal) and the way it stores energy, we have already approached the point where improvements will be negligible. At this point it will have to be able to be mass produce and continue servicing these devices. That takes economical and environmental resources that could otherwise be going into expanding and maintaining our current nuclear energy infrastructure which produces more electricity today than all the "renewable" energies put together. Even when we haven't built a new nuclear facility since 1990 and have been heavily subsidizing every "green" program with taxpayer money nuclear is still the only realistic long-term strategy to resolve these issues. Though there will be safety and disposal concerns as well.
See the following page and article:
https://www.energy.gov/ne/articles/5-fast-facts-about-nuclear-energy
https://e360.yale.edu/features/why-...the-energy-solution-environmentalists-climate
But people are against nuclear energy so I guess until then I will support fossil fuels.
I'm in favor of more nuclear energy use. I think France gets about 90 percent of its electricity from modern and safe facilities. We here in the US seem to have concerns about nuclear energy, yet we seem fine to let these dinosaur plants operate. I think all of the plants in New Jersey, for chrissakes, were built in the 1960s.
You gotta be kidding. Some of you are really falling for this generational bullshit. Boomer, X-er, Z-er, Millennial. What does it matter? Who cares!!! The one guy said it right, its all marketing BS ment to distinguish age groups to make thing easier for businesses and government. When it started getting used in the news and media everyone suddenly had something to say about the "other generations". Its human nature, the second we can draw a line somewhere we all turn into tribal dimwits. Its even worse when you think that Boomers, X-ers, and now Millennials endured the same criticism from the older generation during their own youths and each is now regurgitate the same worn out criticisms to the next generations. We're all so predictable, we should be embarrassed about how easily we turn on ourselves over nonsense.
The US Navy has an unmatched and first rate safety record for nuclear power. This demonstrates that when things are done right, nuclear power generation can work very well. I think the newest plant in the US went on line in 2016, but there has been at least two decades of a drop off in new construction. Some of the operating plants in the US are 40 or 50 years old. Time to start planning their replacement.
Found this article interesting, amusing and timely. The final two paragraphs were relevant to last night's discussions, especially labeling disciplines like Geology and Climate Science "plausible story telling" and opinion (respectively). Personally, I do lay a lot of the tension between generations at the feet of academia. They have become self-serving purveyors of indoctrination vs. knowledge & reason. Luckily most people do wise up as they age and accumulate life experience, but it does not happen overnight. Unfortunately, some never shake off their brainwashing.
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/solutions-are-obvious-us-higher-education-system-broken
https://www.zerohedge.com/political/solutions-are-obvious-us-higher-education-system-broken
@Tyler1, I agree with your posts, although our society is absolutely no where near running at high efficiency. It is 2019 and we are still driving into an office every day because management cannot figure out how to manage people remotely.
walking, bike riding, electric bike, public transportation and especially rail is the most efficient method of transportation.
do we have any idea how woefully inefficient our housing and office space and shopping space is?
Do we realize how many times we could have covered every roof in this country with solar rather than going into the middle east for war. Trillions spent to protect oil interests. We, both left and right are told it is for our freedom, security, etc, etc. It is absolute BS, it is to protect corporate interests.
There are farms dropping Wind Mills into fields they are harvesting. Tons of other areas where wind ins economically viable.
Gas is a toxic substance that you do not want to breath or drink. Before oil was found, we extracted oil form whales. Well gentlemen, we are going to revolutionize the energy market yet again and it will be another improvement for the earth and mankind.
If you can contribute the the improvement of our environment, I would encourage and promote it. I remember when it was common place for people to smoke. It was actually cool to light up while out on the town. Now, because we are so aware the the adverse effects and costs associated with this minor but continuous pollutant, most smoking is shunned.
We will get there with gas and oil as well.
Encouraging news on all fronts, And PS, the world is not going to end.
walking, bike riding, electric bike, public transportation and especially rail is the most efficient method of transportation.
do we have any idea how woefully inefficient our housing and office space and shopping space is?
Do we realize how many times we could have covered every roof in this country with solar rather than going into the middle east for war. Trillions spent to protect oil interests. We, both left and right are told it is for our freedom, security, etc, etc. It is absolute BS, it is to protect corporate interests.
There are farms dropping Wind Mills into fields they are harvesting. Tons of other areas where wind ins economically viable.
Gas is a toxic substance that you do not want to breath or drink. Before oil was found, we extracted oil form whales. Well gentlemen, we are going to revolutionize the energy market yet again and it will be another improvement for the earth and mankind.
If you can contribute the the improvement of our environment, I would encourage and promote it. I remember when it was common place for people to smoke. It was actually cool to light up while out on the town. Now, because we are so aware the the adverse effects and costs associated with this minor but continuous pollutant, most smoking is shunned.
We will get there with gas and oil as well.
Encouraging news on all fronts, And PS, the world is not going to end.