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Closures
- Thread starter Dr.Fitzsimmons
- Start date
I've been wondering for a long time now why they consider AMPs as "human trafficking". Here is the legal definition of that term:
"The recruitment, harboring, transportation, provision, or obtaining of a person for labor or services, through the use of force, fraud, or coercion for the purpose of subjection to involuntary servitude, peonage, debt bondage, or slavery."
Is that really what's happening at these places? I find that really hard to believe. I mean, I'm sure these women are coming to America just to work at these places, but I have always viewed that relatively the same way where other foreigners that own businesses bring in their families from their home country for a while in order to make some money to take back home, etc. In other words, I think these women are doing this voluntarily in order to make more money than they otherwise could back in their home country. Not that they are being "forced" to do this.
Am I wrong? Are there any real "victims" in this situation?
"The recruitment, harboring, transportation, provision, or obtaining of a person for labor or services, through the use of force, fraud, or coercion for the purpose of subjection to involuntary servitude, peonage, debt bondage, or slavery."
Is that really what's happening at these places? I find that really hard to believe. I mean, I'm sure these women are coming to America just to work at these places, but I have always viewed that relatively the same way where other foreigners that own businesses bring in their families from their home country for a while in order to make some money to take back home, etc. In other words, I think these women are doing this voluntarily in order to make more money than they otherwise could back in their home country. Not that they are being "forced" to do this.
Am I wrong? Are there any real "victims" in this situation?
I'm sure that a lot of these ladies later on realize that the life of a sex worker is far from the glamorous portrayal they might have had before signing up, but that doesn't mean they were trapped.
While some of us mongers are respectful and comfortable to work with, there are also some assholes, head cases, and some certifiable sociopaths. And, they all write reviews here.
Not every AMP lady ends her day with glorious feelings of satisfaction beyond the knowledge that money has been made. As you point out, the money is far better than what they could make back home, and far better than the menial jobs many could secure here with limited language/cultural skills.
I met at least one provider who must have become enthralled by the "glamour" and promise of riches, but she had no business being in the business. Didn't want to be touched, didn't want to have any oral contact, and seemed ready to steel herself to survive intercourse. Not much different from my first wife ;-) (and I was paying for this?????). I don't think anyone would consider her trafficked, but she still should not have become a spa girl.
There must be some venues that involve human trafficking, but I suspect it represents a tiny sliver of the activity in DE, PA, NJ, MD, etc. Many are ambitious young women who will be in the life for a few years to make a stake and then transition to the straight world, many others are middle-aged women, often single or divorced mothers, trying to support a family and stay one step ahead of deadbeat dads and abusive ex-husbands or boyfriends.
It's just that crying "human trafficking" solves the question of why spa work must be crushed, since the moral arguments are stale and don't survive scrutiny, let alone warrant significant attention by law enforcement.
My $0.02
While some of us mongers are respectful and comfortable to work with, there are also some assholes, head cases, and some certifiable sociopaths. And, they all write reviews here.
Not every AMP lady ends her day with glorious feelings of satisfaction beyond the knowledge that money has been made. As you point out, the money is far better than what they could make back home, and far better than the menial jobs many could secure here with limited language/cultural skills.
I met at least one provider who must have become enthralled by the "glamour" and promise of riches, but she had no business being in the business. Didn't want to be touched, didn't want to have any oral contact, and seemed ready to steel herself to survive intercourse. Not much different from my first wife ;-) (and I was paying for this?????). I don't think anyone would consider her trafficked, but she still should not have become a spa girl.
There must be some venues that involve human trafficking, but I suspect it represents a tiny sliver of the activity in DE, PA, NJ, MD, etc. Many are ambitious young women who will be in the life for a few years to make a stake and then transition to the straight world, many others are middle-aged women, often single or divorced mothers, trying to support a family and stay one step ahead of deadbeat dads and abusive ex-husbands or boyfriends.
It's just that crying "human trafficking" solves the question of why spa work must be crushed, since the moral arguments are stale and don't survive scrutiny, let alone warrant significant attention by law enforcement.
My $0.02
If they really wanted to tackle human trafficking; there is an area of focus where it’s happening on a very large scale that is essentially ignored. I’ll leave it at that.
So no, it’s not about human trafficking at all. It’s that the business can’t be taxed and it’s low hanging fruit. It gets them funding, some jobs, and some nice headlines in the paper. Sad.
So no, it’s not about human trafficking at all. It’s that the business can’t be taxed and it’s low hanging fruit. It gets them funding, some jobs, and some nice headlines in the paper. Sad.
Stopped at a spot last night, as it’s been a few weeks and it was non-stop calls and walk-in attempts after 930p on a Sunday. Thinking general monger population is now in panic mode to hit their go to spots before more crackdowns happen. I wasn’t even at a well reviewed or expanded services location but just a standard spa near Newark. Don’t know what’s worse — possibility of getting a bogus charge for these providers or the double/triple visits and hours they are putting in.
Have you seen bruises on these girls? I see them from time to time and always wondered what caused then. It could be anything though.
It is also important to remember that sometimes people get stuck in bad situations and have no way of getting out without the proper support. Not saying that is what happens at these places but it is easy to mistake someone who isn't running from a situation to being in a safe situation.
It is also important to remember that sometimes people get stuck in bad situations and have no way of getting out without the proper support. Not saying that is what happens at these places but it is easy to mistake someone who isn't running from a situation to being in a safe situation.
Not to downplay anything, I've become friends with a couple dozen employees who have moved on to greener pastures, but unless you're going to some really shitty places nobody is hitting anyone...
I can't even honestly say I've noticed a bruise on a masseuse before, I'm sure statistically I've noticed but it's so infrequent I didn't think anything of it.
There's a fair bit of the "we'll bring you to America and you'll work in a nail store", which turns into "just kidding it's a massage place". It's not that common from any of my anecdotal experience, and most of the women that happened to are not even doing sex work at all. They're just somewhat embittered or resigned masseuses. The only ones doing sex work like what anyone would revisit or frequent are doing it because it's where the big money's at. And most of the non-Korean Asian sex workers I've met were already in the US and found some job on a language-specific job board which will go unnamed.
As for the """human trafficking""" task force, well, I'd assume the sex work operations that travel around in hotels (motels) are where most of what any sane person would consider problematic has occurred. Is there any mass trafficking to this area in any industry? Maybe, but it's not AMPs. The only cases of trafficking busts I've come across, a few years back while working for LexisNexis, were very isolated cases where some 20 something has a warrant for something, goes to another state with their younger girlfriend and starts pimping them out. Maybe someone with access to a database of legal cases can see what the landscape is these days, but I've never seen actual trafficking charges stick in any of these types of pointless busts.
I can't even honestly say I've noticed a bruise on a masseuse before, I'm sure statistically I've noticed but it's so infrequent I didn't think anything of it.
There's a fair bit of the "we'll bring you to America and you'll work in a nail store", which turns into "just kidding it's a massage place". It's not that common from any of my anecdotal experience, and most of the women that happened to are not even doing sex work at all. They're just somewhat embittered or resigned masseuses. The only ones doing sex work like what anyone would revisit or frequent are doing it because it's where the big money's at. And most of the non-Korean Asian sex workers I've met were already in the US and found some job on a language-specific job board which will go unnamed.
As for the """human trafficking""" task force, well, I'd assume the sex work operations that travel around in hotels (motels) are where most of what any sane person would consider problematic has occurred. Is there any mass trafficking to this area in any industry? Maybe, but it's not AMPs. The only cases of trafficking busts I've come across, a few years back while working for LexisNexis, were very isolated cases where some 20 something has a warrant for something, goes to another state with their younger girlfriend and starts pimping them out. Maybe someone with access to a database of legal cases can see what the landscape is these days, but I've never seen actual trafficking charges stick in any of these types of pointless busts.
… the bruising you have noticed is most likely from cupping or other medicinal extreme massage applications with sticks or rollers..it’s common and the workers do one another often as Wellness treatments or to relieve back pain on muscle soreness..
… if the bruising is on the body it is from these treatments.. facial bruising is another story however that too could be due to Botox or filler treatments that all of these women frequently do..
… the first time I saw bruising like y described I had the same reaction but have since learned otherwise…
… if the bruising is on the body it is from these treatments.. facial bruising is another story however that too could be due to Botox or filler treatments that all of these women frequently do..
… the first time I saw bruising like y described I had the same reaction but have since learned otherwise…
If you want to observe mass exploitation go to any division 1 football game. It isn’t “college football “. It is mega corporate university professional football where the NCAA limits what these corporations are allowed to pay their player employees to below market wages so that the coaches and athletic directors and the corporate universities can earn millions.
Dateline was March 3, and we knew about these closings.
Seems like there will be a few additional ones for March.
After rolling over three spas, it seems they have discovered one "employee who was identified as a likely victim of human trafficking."
Which of course pays for the whole party.
Still curious about what has happened to this identified likely victim.
Seems like there will be a few additional ones for March.
After rolling over three spas, it seems they have discovered one "employee who was identified as a likely victim of human trafficking."
Which of course pays for the whole party.
Still curious about what has happened to this identified likely victim.